Charter flights: auto-suggest alternates?

D

David Kernow

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Today 11:37 AM
Hi,

Here's an idea. On the charter briefing page, how about adding a dropdown menu to the Alternate field that lists, according to the destination selected, a handful of appropriate alternates from which one may be selected (while retaining the option to enter an alternate's ICAO code manually)..?

Given Air-Child's airport database -- and perhaps, if it exists, an external source of information about (say) alternates commonly used -- I'd hope this wouldn't be too tricky to implement. Another dimension could be added by eliminating possibilities according to the weather reports at the time the alternate is selected (even if, when the flight is made, the weather generated or downloaded by the simulator is different).

If nothing else, I'd find a dropdown list of the medium-to-large airports, regardless of suitability, that lay within say 50 nm of the destination (not sufficiently far?) very helpful.

David K
 
That's a great idea, David. Although not as easy to realise as you may think ;)
Currently we don't have any relations between airports and alternates in our database (and I don't know of a data source that would provide such information). The only thing we have is our company routes database that holds exactly one alternate for each connection. For some connection we have more than one route available and, in some rare cases, the alternates may be different but mostly it's always the same airport for a certain destination.

The option of searching for possible alternates in a certain radius from the destination sounds technically feasable as we have the coordinates of all airports. However, I'm not very good with geographic maths, to say the least :oops:
I will think about the problem and maybe we'll find something. Any further ideas are welcome. Thanks for your input, David.
 
Peter Schindler said:
The only thing we have is our company routes database that holds exactly one alternate for each connection.
Click to expand...
Most likely alternates Peter ;) cause selection of alternate(s) is slightly more complicated.
Leave aside no FS significant issues (fuel, technical and medical assistance etc.)
Of course the length of the runway is important, but the main factor is...weather.

First of all don't leave for your destination unless the forecast indicates that the visibility or prevailing RVR will be at or above published minimums at the ETA. :) Note cieling is NOT a consideration.

If the airport you are departing from is below the published landing visibility minimums you must have a takeoff alternate. This alternate will be 1 hour away at single engine cruise speed. The minimums for selecting a takeoff alternate are "derived minimums".

If the destination airport is forcasted to be less than 2000 foot cielings and/or less than 3 miles visibility +/- 1 hour of ETA, than you need one alternate. For purposes of selecting an alternate, two methods of deriving minimums are used... the two approach method and the one approach method. If the airport has two or more separate suitable approaches than you take the two lowest minimum ceiling values and the two lowest minimum visibility values, then add 200 feet to the higher of those ceilings and 1/2 mile to the higher of those visibility values. For instance, let say you have two ILS approaches at an airport, one with minimums of 200 feet and 3/4 mile and the other with minimums of 300 feet and 1/2 mile. Your alternate minimums would now be 500 feet and 1 and 1/4 mile visibility. The one approach method is simpler... you just tack on 400 feet and 1 mile visibility to the one suitable approach. These minimums are for planning and dispatch purposes only. Once in the air, the charted minimums apply.

Now if the first alternate weather and the destination weather is marginal then you need a second alternate. The minimums for the second alternate are derived the same way you derived the mins for the first alternate.

As an aside, the regs requires enough fuel to fly from the airport of departure, to the destination, shoot an approach, proceed to the most distant of the two alternates (if used) and then land with 45 minutes of reserve fuel in the tanks.

Huhhh..I don't think that any software can replace the human to make the right selection of alternates ;)
As for me, this kind of things makes this hobby so beautiful :)
 
Thanks, everyone, for your feedback.
Tomasz Wydrzynski said:
......cause selection of alternate(s) is slightly more complicated.
Leave aside no FS significant issues (fuel, technical and medical assistance etc.)
Of course the length of the runway is important, but the main factor is...weather.
.........
Huhhh..I don't think that any software can replace the human to make the right selection of alternates ;)
As for me, this kind of things makes this hobby so beautiful :)
Click to expand...
I agree, Tomasz -- my thought is merely to provide the list of airports as a starting point from which one could then be chosen to fulfil the briefing. Instead, though, of being hidden in a dropdown menu, perhaps the list could be displayed on-screen and include METAR data -- and be switchable between showing airports within (say) 50 nm, 100 nm, etc. For instance:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Airports within 50 nm 100 nm 150 nm

.................Distance from..........Longest runway
Airport........destination (nm)............(m / ft)..............METAR at [zulu-time]
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ABCD..................21...................500 / 1640............23510KT 90V180 9997 [etc]
EFGH..................35...................100 / 328.............23005KT 180V270 9999 [etc]
IJKL...................49..................1000 / 3281............10020KT 200V280 9995 [etc]
[etc]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(Apologies if my attempt at some layout didn't work.)

It would still be possible to type in an ICAO code for an airport not on the list.

Beyond simple distance from the intended destination, the list could, for instance, be filtered automatically to remove airports without at least one runway that's long enough for the aircraft chosen for the flight. And if METAR was included in the list, then, to go back to the original post, any airports with obviously unsuitable weather (at the time of booking) could be filtered. But I imagine those would be future developments!

David
 
A quick suggestion for the moment:
In vroute (freeware) you will find alternate airports for each destinaton of your flightplane.
In TOPCAT (payware) you find a lists of alternate airports of youre desired destination.
But for weather / runway etc. you have to look for yourself.
Cheers Tom
 
Thanks, Tom -- I recently downloaded vroute, so another reason to get round to trying it. (TOPCAT still feels too advanced for me!)

David
 
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